JUANA SUMMERS, HOST:
When Dylan Mulvaney was 4 years old, she told her mother that she thought God might have made a mistake - that God had put a girl in a boy's body. Dylan's mother responded that God doesn't make mistakes. It would be years before Dylan officially embraced her identity as a transgender woman, when she was 25, after coming out as gay at 14 and nonbinary at 24 - which is why she didn't feel like going the route of the dramatic coming-out video.
DYLAN MULVANEY: I had done those before. This was my third time coming out, and I felt like I needed to find the funny.
SUMMERS: So Dylan took to TikTok to post her lighthearted take on the way she was figuring out what it meant to live as a girl.
(SOUNDBITE OF TIKTOK VIDEO)
MULVANEY: Day 1 of being a girl, and I have already cried three times. I wrote a scathing email that I did not send. I ordered dresses online that I couldn't afford. And then when someone asked me how I was, I said I'm fine, when I wasn't fine, so...
I really didn't expect it to turn into a series until there was, you know, many supporters but many hateful comments. And I wanted to show those people that I had many layers to me and that there were other more, you know, nuanced versions for them to see. And then it became sort of this way to track not only my journey, but, you know, to share a little bit of trans joy, which I think now the book is an extension of that joy.
SUMMERS: That new book is "Paper Doll: Notes From A Late Bloomer." It's a memoir of Mulvaney's explosive fame, documenting her transition and all the highs and lows that came with it. And a warning - this interview mentions suicide.
MULVANEY: I think that I didn't know how to get to where, like, a Laverne Cox, you know, was - these icons - Dominique Jackson, Our Lady J, who's now a dear mentor and friend. I wasn't sure how to get to where these icons were in their transitions. And so I really wanted to take people along that journey. And, you know, transness, right now, it's being seen as this very villainous thing. It almost feels like Godzilla taking over the world, and yet we're less than 1% of the population. And most of the community is really struggling to get the care that they deserve and that they need. And so my documentation of it and my experience of, you know, obtaining that care so easily and having these opportunities isn't quite as reflective as the general community is. But I really hope that one day it will be, that, you know, every trans person feels like they have the opportunity to thrive.
SUMMERS: There's an incident that happened back in 2023 that you call Beergate, and I want to get into all of that. It's been covered a lot, but I want to briefly recap for folks. Back in April of 2023, you posted this sponsored video for the company, Bud Light.
(SOUNDBITE OF AD)
MULVANEY: This month, I celebrated my Day 365 of womanhood, and Bud Light sent me possibly the best gift ever - a can with my face on it. Check out...
SUMMERS: And that led to this really big backlash. Conservatives boycotted the ban (ph). Some people may recall the musician Kid Rock posting this video of himself. He was online, shooting Bud Light cases. You were also the subject of some ugly vitriol online - some violent threats. You've talked about this in the book. I know that you've spoken out about this before, but I just want to know, what is it that you want people to understand about what that time in your life was like for you - how you experienced it?
MULVANEY: I talk about it in the book like dark thoughts, and I write them sometimes as little bubbles that look like black clouds. But they were very real, and they were not just an illustration in my life. They were - you know, they showed up as suicidal ideation and dissociation. And I think, you know, so often when you're seen as such a classically happy person that people don't really account for that. But behind the scenes, I was hurting in a way that I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.
SUMMERS: You wrote about the fact that you wished that you'd stepped away to get mental health treatment in the immediate aftermath of what happened then. I wonder, having gone through that experience and now being at a very different point in your life, what did it teach you about yourself? What did you learn about yourself?
MULVANEY: Well, not only what I learned about myself, I think what I learned about the world is that, especially, when it comes to women in the public eye, so often, we are not allowed to create boundaries. We're not allowed to ask for what we need because of how we're treated. And I think I learned that, in that moment, I needed to take my transition back for my own self and that this wasn't up to anyone else, whether that's the government or my followers or, you know, branded companies. I needed to make sure that the decisions I was making on behalf of me and my body were my own.
SUMMERS: Shifting gears a bit, I know that you grew up in the church and going to Catholic school, and I also did. And I know that, for me, in my adulthood, faith is a thing that I've just - I've struggled to figure out where I land, and that seems to be something that you and I share. And you...
MULVANEY: Yes.
SUMMERS: You talk about - in the book, about how the religion and the church that you were brought up in doesn't really fit anymore. What's your relationship with your faith today?
MULVANEY: Oh, you know, I see so much beauty, not only in transness, but in so much of the world, even during this really, really dark, dark time. And I think, so often, people are using religion against queer and trans people in a really ugly way, but I also see and honor why queer and trans folks are deeply triggered by some of these things. So, you know, I kind of tried to hide the peas in the mashed potatoes of the book, of letting people know that I do, you know, believe in something bigger than me and that my transness is not something to be ashamed of and that there were no mistakes made when I was created and that this is just part of my story and - even though it looks a little different than most women's.
SUMMERS: You write to the reader in the opening of this book that - I need you to believe that sweet earnestness still exists. And Dylan, that is just something that - from everything I've seen and everything I've heard that you seem to embody. How is it that you manage to hold on to that?
MULVANEY: Whenever I've tried the pessimistic thing, it just doesn't feel as good. And I've arrived at this place of a thousand bad things can go down, and they can try to make me into a pessimist. But at the end of the day, a thousand and one great things are possible and have already happened. And that's - I'm just going to go chase a thousand and two, because I don't think I'm interested in living this life for anything but constant discovery and seeing what a new day can bring. And that might sound so silly, but I would like to believe that we can live that way.
SUMMERS: Dylan, what do you hope comes next for you? What are you looking for in your next chapter?
MULVANEY: Oh, gosh, I would love to feel safe, you know, in my country. I would love to watch other trans people thriving and given the opportunities that I have and not met with such ridicule. My next writing project I've given myself is a rom-com. I'd love to write something where a trans person is finding joy and isn't just a victim on "Law & Order." I think we need to find us everywhere, in all forms of media, not just the rage bait.
SUMMERS: We've been speaking with Dylan Mulvaney. Her memoir, "Paper Doll: Notes From A Late Bloomer," is out now. Dylan, thank you so much.
MULVANEY: Thank you. This was so lovely.
SUMMERS: If you or someone you love is experiencing a crisis, call or text 988 for the suicide and crisis lifeline.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "NO ONE IS ALONE")
DIANE PHELAN: (As Cinderella, singing) No one is alone. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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